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Oklahoma State Football

Monday Gundy on QB Competition and How it May not End this Saturday

September 11, 2023
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STILLWATER – If you were hoping to see light at the end of the tunnel with the Oklahoma State quarterback situation. Like one more three quarterback rotation this Saturday in the final non conference game with South Alabama and then the coronation of a starting quarterback for the Big 12 opener on Sept. 23 at Iowa State, well, you may be disappointed after Mike Gundy’s weekley news conference.

Personally, I’m more concerned about establishing a running game right off the top of these games. Run the football like you have in the second half of the first two games and it might not matter who is at quarterback. If you were banking on a QB1 when the Pokes get to Iowa then maybe you need to visit Field of Dreams. The head coach didn’t give you any promise when asked point blank if the rotation at quarterback would end after South Alabama?

Bruce Waterfield/OSU Athletics
Bowman at the front of the stretch line with Rangel and then Gundy.

“This one (competition) is unique because of transfer portal players coming in that are experienced and are in their last year to perform,” Gundy said of his team overall. “We’re playing a lot of players if you’ve noticed, not just at quarterback.”

Then he got serious. He looked out in the audience of media members and posed the question.

“So, right now, if I asked you and everybody has opinions,” Gundy started. “You have to tell two of the quarterbacks you’re not playing, you’re out. Who are you telling and when they ask why, how would you explain it?”

Bruce Waterfield/OSU Athletics
Rangel launches a pass in Tempe last Saturday.

Good point.

Alan Bowman is 24-of-40 for 193-yards with no touchdowns and no interceptions. He has led the team to two field goals in the first game and a touchdown on Saturday at Arizona State.

Garret Rangel is 16-of-24 passing for 164-yards and two touchdowns throwing one interception. He has led the team to two touchdowns and a field goal. 

Gunnar Gundy is 12-of-16 for 138-yards and one touchdown with no interceptions. Gundy has led the team to three touchdowns and one field goal. 

It is painfully even.

“It keeps our offense from opening up with what we do,” Gundy explained of an effect of the rotation that most of us have felt. “We have to keep reduced packages (for the game plan) so we can get the reps we need before the games, which I like because I think overall it helps our offense.”

© Rob Schumacher/The Republic / USA TODAY NETWORK
A lot of Bowman’s passes at Arizona State came on the run because the ASU defense was blitzing their eyeballs out.

I would be opposed. Something I have observed is Bowman has had far fewer run plays called when he has been in at quarterback. The plan has been balanced for the most part for Rangel and Gundy. Both quarterbacks also have the advantage of being able to run more explosive at quarterback. It has shown up some in the respect and the way the defenses have played them. 

Overall, the quarterbacks are 52-of-80 for 65 percent passing with 495-yards with three touchdowns and only one interception. The group has a quarterback rating of a rich 126.9. 

"They all played pretty good, they graded out at almost 88% mentally, as a group,” Gundy reported. “I didn't put all those stats together, but we just got to stay the course.”

Gundy made it sound like it is all acceptable for now. 

“Those are good grades, last week they graded close to 90%, which is a really high grade for a quarterback,” Gundy added. “It is difficult to get a good grade at that position." 

I’ve always felt that the team often identifies the starting quarterback in a competition by who they gravitate to. Gundy has kept an eye on that and that appears to be even as well.

Bruce Waterfield/OSU Athletics
Gundy has looked very comfortable.

"I watched them in practice, I watch them in the game, I watch them in the hotel and I watch them in the meals. I just had a discussion with someone else about it, I don't see (the team) partial to anybody. I think they like them all…” Gundy said he hasn’t noticed any of the three being dramtically more popular than the others. 

“I watch their interactions among each other and I watch their relationship with their coaches and all those guys, and they're goofing around, showing each other their phones and they're laughing and all that,” the head coach said. “I try to keep a pretty good barometer on that, and I think they're fine."

Gundy is fine, but the rest of us are antsy. I know the quarterbacks are antsy some. It’s not natural, butyou know at Oklahoma State it hasn’t been common to have three quarterbacks all ready to go in, play, and be successful. In the transfer portal age at that position it is highly unusual. By the end of the season that depth may win you a few games, but the important question now is whether rotating the quarterbacks could cost you a game?

 

Discussion from...

Monday Gundy on QB Competition and How it May not End this Saturday

6,555 Views | 18 Replies | Last: 1 yr ago by pokefan89
CProc7
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Safe to assume we will see Gundy, Rangel, Bowman in that order? It's the only order we haven't seen yet. Also seems Bowman is in before any "adjustments" have been made so any yards we get is on his arm. Maybe with a run game it'll open up WRs while he's playing.
Joe Khatib
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Ok, maybe the three headed monster plays through the Iowa State game but then you face a monster next on the schedule after a bye week so that is when the decision is probably made! My personal opinion is if Rangel does enough good things in the next two games he is the pick because Bowman is done after this year and Gunnar isn't going anywhere and I think that you want to keep Rangel out of the portal!!! I could be totally wrong and I guess we see how it plays out!
GumbyFromPokeyLand
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IMO, you always play for the current year and never for future years. If the team even suspects you're coaching for next year, you run a serious risk of losing the locker room, maybe for several years.

Unless one of the QBs distinguishes themselves this weekend, I think you got to go with the QB that the team is most productive/comfortable with. If by chance that's Bowman, I think there should be a package for Gundy that includes some QB run/pass option.
True wisdom is knowing what you don't know.
- Confucius
principalg
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Make a decision. If you cannot differentiate on ability, go with your gut. The offense needs some continuity and leadership.
GumbyFromPokeyLand
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principalg said:

Make a decision. If you cannot differentiate on ability, go with your gut. The offense needs some continuity and leadership.


Would be an interesting discussion with the QB room, and thus the team.

"Hey guys, my gut says X is QB1, Y is QB2 and Z is QB3. Don't ask me why"

True wisdom is knowing what you don't know.
- Confucius
RodeoPoke
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Joe Khatib said:

Ok, maybe the three headed monster plays through the Iowa State game but then you face a monster next on the schedule after a bye week so that is when the decision is probably made! My personal opinion is if Rangel does enough good things in the next two games he is the pick because Bowman is done after this year and Gunnar isn't going anywhere and I think that you want to keep Rangel out of the portal!!! I could be totally wrong and I guess we see how it plays out!
the decision should ONLY be made on the individual who gives us the best chance to win THIS YEAR. PERIOD.

If Rangel doesn't win it outright, and it makes him sad enough to bail, then we probably don't need somebody like that around... we do have the super human freshman QB from Nebraska in the wings, and we can get another grad transfer next year if we need it.

We should not base decisions on whether a kid may leave if he doesn't win the job. Not ever.

May the best QB win the job, so far, it's looking like Gundy, but I think Bowman may get it done, I haven't been too impressed with Bowman's deep ball so far.

pokefan89
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When you get paid millions, sometimes you have to have those hard conversations. If a 15 yr successful coach goes with a gut feeling, that's good enough reason for me.
Ostateman
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Joe Khatib said:

Ok, maybe the three headed monster plays through the Iowa State game but then you face a monster next on the schedule after a bye week so that is when the decision is probably made! My personal opinion is if Rangel does enough good things in the next two games he is the pick because Bowman is done after this year and Gunnar isn't going anywhere and I think that you want to keep Rangel out of the portal!!! I could be totally wrong and I guess we see how it plays out!
Now, if Rangel can't win the QB position out right, why is it so important to keep him out of the TP? If there's a superstar QB that could come in and take over the position just because we have no clear defined #1?
In fact, the kid from Nebraska is going to have something to say about the next round of "Name That Quarterback".
I know there are rules, but do we really want to follow them now?
Ostateman
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principalg said:

Make a decision. If you cannot differentiate on ability, go with your gut. The offense needs some continuity and leadership.
Have you not been paying attention to Gundy's assessment nor the stats? The offense seems to be fine with all of the QBs.
The offense needs to concentrate more on blocking that who's handing the ball of to the RB that they're supposed to be blocking for.

Why we continue to have to address the OL's inability to block in the first half of a game is a lot more pressing than having 3 QBs that haven't differentiated themselves enough to be the designated leader.

And once we have a QB picked to start, doesn't mean he's going to have the hot hand or even stay healthy.

I honestly believe the QB situation will flesh itself out within a couple of weeks. Why do you continue to worry about picking a starter just so the opposing team knows who to practice for all week?

I realize your coaching experience may be more extensive than most and it's a given that Gundy has a history of choosing QBs poorly until it the situation becomes desperate.
He's not going to change now and suddenly be a QB guru.
One would think a former college QB would be better at it, but I'm reminded of another former QB that couldn't pick his nose with instructions -- John Elway of the Denver Broncos.
Great QB. Lousy QB draft picker.

The big reason Gundy wanted to concentrate on the running game this year is probably because we don't have a Patrick Mahomes or even a Spencer Sanders at the QB position.
That and we struggle with OL people for the entire season. But a workable, good OL would go a tremendous way in continuity.
We've got the leadership.
I know there are rules, but do we really want to follow them now?
Joe Khatib
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Ostateman said:

Joe Khatib said:

Ok, maybe the three headed monster plays through the Iowa State game but then you face a monster next on the schedule after a bye week so that is when the decision is probably made! My personal opinion is if Rangel does enough good things in the next two games he is the pick because Bowman is done after this year and Gunnar isn't going anywhere and I think that you want to keep Rangel out of the portal!!! I could be totally wrong and I guess we see how it plays out!
Now, if Rangel can't win the QB position out right, why is it so important to keep him out of the TP? If there's a superstar QB that could come in and take over the position just because we have no clear defined #1?
In fact, the kid from Nebraska is going to have something to say about the next round of "Name That Quarterback".
If none of the three have separated them selves from the other you go with the one that has the most promising possibilities AND LET HIM TAKE THE MAJORITY OF THE FIRST TEAM SNAPS TO DEVELOP RHTHYM AND CONTINUITY WITH THE OFFENSE and see if he does develop!!! He is the best combination right now of mobility and passing game ability to throw the ball!!! Maybe I am wrong, but there is a reason he WAS THE BACKUP TO SANDERS LAST YEAR AND NOT GUNNAR! Bowman has looked decent but has not provided any WOW factor that puts him head and shoulders above the other two!!!
Joe Khatib
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RodeoPoke said:

Joe Khatib said:

Ok, maybe the three headed monster plays through the Iowa State game but then you face a monster next on the schedule after a bye week so that is when the decision is probably made! My personal opinion is if Rangel does enough good things in the next two games he is the pick because Bowman is done after this year and Gunnar isn't going anywhere and I think that you want to keep Rangel out of the portal!!! I could be totally wrong and I guess we see how it plays out!
the decision should ONLY be made on the individual who gives us the best chance to win THIS YEAR. PERIOD.

If Rangel doesn't win it outright, and it makes him sad enough to bail, then we probably don't need somebody like that around... we do have the super human freshman QB from Nebraska in the wings, and we can get another grad transfer next year if we need it.

We should not base decisions on whether a kid may leave if he doesn't win the job. Not ever.

May the best QB win the job, so far, it's looking like Gundy, but I think Bowman may get it done, I haven't been too impressed with Bowman's deep ball so far.


So tell me who is that going to be???
Joe Khatib
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GumbyFromPokeyLand said:

IMO, you always play for the current year and never for future years. If the team even suspects you're coaching for next year, you run a serious risk of losing the locker room, maybe for several years.

Unless one of the QBs distinguishes themselves this weekend, I think you got to go with the QB that the team is most productive/comfortable with. If by chance that's Bowman, I think there should be a package for Gundy that includes some QB run/pass option.
At some point they have to go with the guy who they think is the one to get it done Gumby! My guess is that may be after Iowa State but it will be critical going into K State and the rest of the schedule that one guy gets the vast majority of the first team snaps so that they develop some type of rhythm and continuity and consistency on the offensive side of the ball which hopefully allows that unit to really get going and look much better and be productive!
RodeoPoke
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Joe Khatib said:

RodeoPoke said:

Joe Khatib said:

Ok, maybe the three headed monster plays through the Iowa State game but then you face a monster next on the schedule after a bye week so that is when the decision is probably made! My personal opinion is if Rangel does enough good things in the next two games he is the pick because Bowman is done after this year and Gunnar isn't going anywhere and I think that you want to keep Rangel out of the portal!!! I could be totally wrong and I guess we see how it plays out!
the decision should ONLY be made on the individual who gives us the best chance to win THIS YEAR. PERIOD.

If Rangel doesn't win it outright, and it makes him sad enough to bail, then we probably don't need somebody like that around... we do have the super human freshman QB from Nebraska in the wings, and we can get another grad transfer next year if we need it.

We should not base decisions on whether a kid may leave if he doesn't win the job. Not ever.

May the best QB win the job, so far, it's looking like Gundy, but I think Bowman may get it done, I haven't been too impressed with Bowman's deep ball so far.


So tell me who is that going to be???
HOPEFULLY, it's going to be the QB who actually "EARNS" it and deserves it, not somebody that might have more upside based on "nothing".

I already said that I thing Gunnar has show the most, I would sure hate to lose him in the Portal, despite your speculation that he wouldn't leave for better opportunities (ala, Sanders)

Your whole premise is based solely on your own conjecture.

RodeoPoke
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Joe Khatib said:

GumbyFromPokeyLand said:

IMO, you always play for the current year and never for future years. If the team even suspects you're coaching for next year, you run a serious risk of losing the locker room, maybe for several years.

Unless one of the QBs distinguishes themselves this weekend, I think you got to go with the QB that the team is most productive/comfortable with. If by chance that's Bowman, I think there should be a package for Gundy that includes some QB run/pass option.
At some point they have to go with the guy who they think is the one to get it done Gumby! My guess is that may be after Iowa State but it will be critical going into K State and the rest of the schedule that one guy gets the vast majority of the first team snaps so that they develop some type of rhythm and continuity and consistency on the offensive side of the ball which hopefully allows that unit to really get going and look much better and be productive!

you seem to be the only one claiming there is no "rhythm, continuity and consistency and productivity", and you seem to be the only one claiming that it is critical.

Coach already said it will be based on how they practice (even when deciding which order the 3 will play against South Bama).

We don't get to see them practice, so we really don't know what is going on, or being said (regarding a decision).

We have a bye week before KState, so lots more practices for them to evaluate, if the decision isn't made prior to that.
Eclectic
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Completely agree! Bowman hasn't looked comfortable to me at all the first two games. I understand he's had several drops, but my question is how much of that has been forced? Between Gundy and Rangel, Rangel obviously performed better last season. Gundy has shown patience and poise this year, but is it going to be the same when he's getting his butt handed to him every play? Is it going to be a remake of last year? Stats don't tell the truth with such a small sample size (this year). In my mind, Rangel is the only one with any promise after their collegiate career. Gundy? Possibly, but I don't think it's something he desires. I completely understand the "it's about winning this year", but for the continued success of the program, you're failing if you're not developing talented individuals that you initially recruited in hopes of recruiting more. Everyone likes to complain about the lack of 4 or 5 *'s. And I understand not everyone of them are going to develop as much as Gundy has been able to develop 3*'s. But ultimately I think you have to go with the person that has proven themselves as the best over the past year+.
Go Pokes!
TXPokeEnding
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Here's a different take. Coach Gundy more and more likes to limit the reps for his players. Keeps them fresh and decreases the probabilities of injuries. So...why not QB, he might be thinking? If you have three QBs all about the same in effectiveness, why ever pick just one? Rotate 'em. Keep them fresh. It bucks the conventional wisdom of picking a QB1. Not everyone has a Caleb Williams, an obvious QB1. Maybe, he's testing the future of the Portal. If you end up with multiple pretty similar guys, rotate. Don't get forced into picking one.

I'm not saying I agree, but I do like leaders who challenge dogma.
GumbyFromPokeyLand
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pokefan89 said:

When you get paid millions, sometimes you have to have those hard conversations. If a 15 yr successful coach goes with a gut feeling, that's good enough reason for me.


It's really not a question as to whether it's a good enough reason for you, or me, or the media. It's whether it's a good enough reason for the players involved and the rest of the team. I'd hope every player on the team would feel like their position on the depth chart would be determined based on play, not someone's gut. JMO
True wisdom is knowing what you don't know.
- Confucius
pokefan89
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I think the rest of the team would just care about what's best for the team. And just an opinion, but it seems like picking a player and giving him more reps and having some continuity with the other guys would be better, long term, than to keep rotating.

Even if you want to play all 3 guys, rotating at exactly 4 series regardless of how things are going seems wild to me.

We'll see how it plays out, we'll never REALLY know though for sure. He could pick a guy for K-State and the player struggles. Some people will say he should have picked someone else, some people will say he would have played better if he had more reps.

It seems hard to believe that all 3 players throughout all practices and everything have played out exactly the same skill-wise and intangibles wise.
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